格鲁吉亚公共广播节目主持人:Celeste Headlee

首先,我想让大家举手示意一下,有多少人曾经在 Facebook 上拉黑过好友,因为他们发表过关于政治,宗教,儿童权益,或者食物等不恰当的言论,有多少人至少有一个不想见的人,因为你就是不想和对方说话?

All right, I want to see a show of hands how many of you have unfriended someone on Facebook because they said something offensive about politics or religion, childcare, food? And how many of you know at least one person that you avoid because you just don’t want to talk to them?

要知道,在过去想要一段礼貌的交谈我们只要遵循亨利·希金斯在《窈窕淑女》中的忠告,只谈论天气和你的健康状况就行了。但这些年随着气候变化以及反对疫苗运动的开展——这招不怎么管用了。

因此,在我们生活的这个世界,这个每一次交谈都有可能发展为争论的世界,政客无法彼此交谈。甚至为那些鸡毛蒜皮的事情,都有人群情绪激昂地赞成或者反对,这太不正常了。

皮尤研究中心对一万名美国成年人做了一次调查,发现此刻我们的偏激程度,我们立场鲜明的程度,比历史上任何时期都要高。

You know, it used to be that in order to have a polite conversation, we just had to follow the advice of Henry Higgins in “My Fair Lady”: Stick to the weather and your health. But these days, with climate change and anti-vaxxing, those subjects—are not safe either. 

So this world that we live in, this world in which every conversation has the potential to devolve into an argument, where our politicians can’t speak to one another, and where even the most trivial of issues have someone fighting both passionately for it and against it, it’s not normal. 

Pew Research did a study of 10,000 American adults, and they found that at this moment, we are more polarized; we are more divided than we ever have been in history.

我们更不倾向于妥协,这意味着我们没有倾听彼此。我们做的各种决定,选择生活在何处,与谁结婚甚至和谁交朋友,都只基于我们已有的信念。再重复一遍,这只说明我们没有倾诉彼此。

交谈需要平静讲述和倾听,而不知怎么的,我们却偏偏失去了这种平衡。技术进步是部分原因,比如智能手机,现在就在你们手里,或者就在旁边,随手就能拿到。

We are less likely to compromise, which means we’re not listening to each other. And we make decisions about where to live, who to marry and even who our friends are going to be based on what we already believe. Again, that means we’re not listening to each other.

 A conversation requires a balance between talking and listing, and somewhere along the way, we lost that balance. Now, part of that is due to technology. The smartphones that you all either have in your hands or close enough that you could grab them really quickly.

根据皮尤的研究,大约三分之一的美国青少年每天发送超过一百条短信。而这中间很多人,几乎是所有人,更倾向于给朋友发短信,而不是面对面的交谈。

《大西洋》杂志等过一篇很棒的文章,作者是高中教室保罗·巴恩维尔。他给自己的学生一项交流任务,希望教会他们如何不借助笔记针对某一话题发表演讲。然后他说:“我开始意识到…我开始意识到交流能力,可能是最被我们忽视的,没有好好教授的技能。孩子每天花费数小时通过屏幕接触创意和其他伙伴,但很少有机会去发觉自己的人际交往技能。”

这听起来很好笑,但我们必须问问自己:“21世纪,有什么技能会比维持一段连贯、自信的谈话更为重要?”

According to the Pew Research, About a third of American teenagers send more than a hundred texts a day. And many of them, almost most of them, are more likely to text their friends than they are to talk to them face to face. 

There’s this great piece in The Atlantic. It was written by a high school teacher named Paul Barnwell. And he gave his kids a communication project. He wanted to teach them how to speak on a specific subject without using notes. And he said this:” I came to realize…”“I came to realize that conversational competence might be the single most overlooked skill we fail to teach. Kids spend hours each day engaging with ideas and each other through screens, but rarely do they have an opportunity to hone their interpersonal communications skills. 

It might sound like a funny question, but we have to ask ourselves. Is there any 21st-century skill more important than being able to sustain coherent, confident conversation?”

现在,我的职业就是跟别人谈话。诺贝尔奖获得者、卡车司机、亿万富翁、幼儿园老师、州长、水管工。我和我喜欢的人交谈,也和我不喜欢的人交谈。我和在个人层面非常不同的人交谈。但我仍旧和他们有很好的交流。所以,我希望接下来的 10 分钟教你们如何谈话,以及如何倾听。

你们中间很多人以及听过无数建议,比如看着对方的眼睛,提前想好可以讨论的有趣话题,注视,点头并且微笑来表明你的专注,重复你刚才听到的,或者做总结。

我想让你们忘掉所有这些,全部没用。根本没有必要去学习如何表现你的很专心,如果你确实很专心。我其实是把作为职业访谈者一模一样的技巧,用在了日常生活中。

Now, I make my living talking to people: Nobel Prize winners, truck drivers, billionaires, kindergarten teachers, heads of state, plumbers. I talk to people that I like. I talk to people that I don’t like. I talk to some people that I disagree with deeply on a personal level. But I still have a great conversation with them. So I’d like to spend the next 10 minutes or so teaching you how to talk and how to listen. 

Many of you have already heard a lot of advice on this, things like look the person in the eye, things of interesting topics to discuss in advance, look, nod and smile to show that you’re paying attention, repeat back what you just heard or summarize it. 

So I want you to forget all of that. It is crap. There is no reason to learn how to show you’re paying attention, if you are in fact paying attention. Now, I actually use the exact same skills as a professional interviewer that I do in regular life. 

好,我要来教你们如何采访他人,这其实会帮助你们学习如何成为更好的沟通者。

学习开始一段交谈,不浪费时间,不感到无聊,以及最重要的是,不冒犯任何人。我们都曾有过很棒的交谈。我们曾有过,我们知道那是什么感觉,那种结束之后令你感到很享受,很受鼓舞的交谈,或者令你觉得你和别人建立了真实的连接,或者让你完全得到了他人的理解。没有理由说,你大部分人际互动不能成为那样,我有 10 条基本规则,我会一条条给你们解释,但说真的,如果你选择一条并且熟练掌握,你就已经可以享受更愉快的交谈了。

So, I’m going to teach you how to interview people, and that’s actually going to help you learn how to be better conversationalists.

Learn to have a conversation without wasting your time, without getting bored, and, please God, without offending anybody. We’ve all had really great conversations. We’ve had them before. We know what it’s like. The kind of conversation where you walk away feeling engaged and inspired, or where you feel like you’ve made a real connection or you’ve been perfectly understood. There is no reason why most of your interactions can’t be like that. So I have 10 basic rules. I’m going to walk you through all of them, but honestly, if you just choose one of them and master it, you’ll already enjoy better conversations.

第一条:不要三心二意。

我不是说单纯放下你的手机、平板电脑、车钥匙,或者随便什么握在手里的东西。我的意思是,处在当下。进入那个情境中去。不要想着你之前和老板的争吵。不要想着你晚饭吃什么。如果你想退出交谈,就退出交谈,但不要身在曹营心在汉。

Number one: Don"t multitask. 

And I don"t mean just set down your cell phone or your tablet or your car keys or whatever is in your hand. I mean, be present. Be in that moment. Don"t think about your argument you had with your boss. Don"t think about what you"re going to have for dinner. If you want to get out of the conversation, get out of the conversation, but don"t be half in it and half out of it.

第二条:不要好为人师。

如果你想要表达自己的看法,又不想留下任何机会让人回应、争论、反驳或阐发,写博客去。有个很好的理由来说明我的谈话里为什么不允许有“专家说教”:因为真的很无聊。如果对方是个保守派,那一定讨厌奥巴马、食品券和堕胎。如果对方是个自由派,那一定会讨厌大银行、石油公司和迪克·切尼。完全可以预测的。你肯定不希望那样。

你需要在进入每一次交流时都假定自己可以学习到一些东西。著名的治疗师M.斯科特·派克说过,真正的倾听需要把自己放在一边。有时候,这意味着把你的个人观点放在一边。他说感受到这种接纳,说话的人会变得越来越不脆弱敏感,因而越来越有可能打开自己的内心世界, 呈现给倾听者。 

再强调一遍,假定你需要学习新东西。比尔·奈伊说:“每一个你将要见到的人都有你不知道的东西。”我来复述一下:每个人都是某方面的专家。

Number two: Don"t pontificate. 

If you want to state your opinion without any opportunity for response or argument or pushback or growth, write a blog. Now, there"s a really good reason why I don"t allow pundits on my show: Because they"re really boring. If they"re conservative, they"re going to hate Obama and food stamps and abortion. If they’re liberal, they"re going to hate big banks and oil corporations and Dick Cheney. Totally predictable. And you don"t want to be like that. 

You need to enter every conversation assuming that you have something to learn. The famed therapist M. Scott Peck said that true listening requires a setting aside of oneself. And sometimes that means setting aside your personal opinion. He said that sensing this acceptance, the speaker will become less and less vulnerable and more and more likely to open up the inner recesses of his or her mind to the listener. 

Again, assume that you have something to learn. Bill Nye: "Everyone you will ever meet knows something that you don"t." I put it this way: Everybody is an expert in something.

第三条:使用开放式问题。

关于这一点,请参考记者采访的提问方式。以“谁”、“ 什么”、“ 何时”、“ 何地”、“ 为什么”或“如何”开始提问。

如果你询问一个复杂的问题将会得到一个简单的回答。如果我问你:“你当时恐惧吗?”你会回应那句话中最有力的词,即“恐惧”,而答案将是 “是的”或者“不是”。“你当时气愤吗?”“是的,我当时气得很。”

让对方去描述,对方才是了解情境的人。 试着这样问对方:“那是什么样子?”,“你感觉怎么样?”因为这样一来,对方可能需要停下来想一想,而你会得到更有意思的回答。

Number three: Use open-ended questions. 

In this case, take a cue from journalists. Start your questions with who, what, when, where, why or how.

If you put in a complicated question, you’re going to get a simple answer out. If I ask you "Were you terrified?" you"re going to respond to the most powerful word in that sentence, which is "terrified and the answer is "Yes, I was" or "No, I wasn’t." "Were you angry?" "Yes, I was very angry." 

Let them describe it. They"re the ones that know. Try asking them things like, "What was that like?" "How did that feel?" Because then they might have to stop for a moment and think about it, and you"re going to get a much more interesting response.

第四条:顺其自然。

也就是说,想法会自然流入你的头脑,而你需要将它们表达出来。我们常听到采访中嘉宾说了几分钟,然后主持人回过来问问题,这问题好像不知道从何而来或者已经被回答过了。这说明主持人可能两分钟前就没在听,因为他想到了这个非常机智的问题,于是就心心念念想着问这个问题。我们同样也会这么干。当我们和某人坐在一起交谈时,我们突然想起那次和休·杰克曼在咖啡店的偶遇。

Number four: Go with the flow. 

That means thoughts will come into your mind and you need to let them go out of your mind. We"ve heard interviews often in which a guest is talking for several minutes and then the host comes back in and asks a question which seems like it comes out of nowhere, or it"s already been answered. That means the host probably stopped listening two minutes ago because he thought of this really clever question, and he was just bound and determined to say that. And we do the exact same thing. We"re sitting there having a conversation with someone, and then we remember that time that we met Hugh Jack man in a coffee shop.

第五条:如果你不知道,就说你不知道。

广播节目里的人,尤其在全国公共广播电台(NPR)中,非常明白他们的谈话会被播放出去。所以他们对自己声称专业的地方以及言之凿凿的东西会更加小心。要学着这样做,谨言慎行,谈话应该是负责任的行为。

Number five: If you don"t know, say that you don"t know. 

Now, people on the radio, especially on NPR, are much more aware that they"re going on the record, and so they"re more careful about what they claim to be an expert in and what they claim to know for sure. Do that. Err on the side of caution. Talk should not be cheap.

第六条:不要把自己的经历和他人比较。

如果对方谈论失去了家人,不要就势开始说你失去家人的事情。如果对方在说工作上的困扰,不要告诉他们你多么讨厌你的工作。这不一样的,永远不可能一样。任何经历都是独一无二的。而且,更重要的是,这不是在谈论你的事。你不需要在此刻证明你多么能干,或者你经受了多少痛苦。

有人曾问史蒂芬·霍金他的智商是多少,他回答道:“我不知道。拿智商吹牛的人都是屌丝。”

Number six: Don’t equate your experience with theirs. 

If they"re talking about having lost a family member, don"t start talking about the time you lost a family member. If they"re talking about the trouble they"re having at work, don"t tell them about how much you hate your job. It"s not the same. It is never the same. All experiences are individual. And, more importantly, it is not about you. You don’t need to take that moment to prove how amazing you are or how much you’ve suffered. 

Somebody asked Stephen Hawking once what his IQ was, and he said, "I have no idea. People who brag about their IQs are losers."

第七条:尽量别重复自己的话。

这很咄咄逼人,也很无聊。但我们很容易这样做。尤其是在工作交谈中,或者和孩子的交谈中。我们想声明一个观点,于是换着方式不停地说,别这样。

Number seven: Try not to repeat yourself. 

It"s condescending, and it"s really boring, and we tend to do it a lot. Especially in work conversations or in conversations with our kids, we have a point to make, so we just keep rephrasing it over and over. Don"t do that.

第八条:少说废话。

说白了,没人在乎那些年份、名字、日期等等这些你努力试图在脑中回想的种种细节,别人不在乎,他们关注的是你,对方关心你是什么样的人,和你有什么共同点。所以忘掉细节吧,别管它们。

Number eight: Stay out of the weeds. Frankly, people don"t care about the years, the names, the dates, all those details that you"re struggling to come up with in your mind. They don"t care. What they care about is you. They care about what you"re like, what you have in common. So forget the details. Leave them out.

第九条:这不是最后一条,但是最重要的一条。认真倾听。

我说不上来到底有多少重要人士都说过倾听可能是最重要的,第一重要的你可以提升的技能。 佛曰——我转述一下,“如果你嘴不停,你就学不到东西。”卡尔文·柯立芝曾说:“从没有人是因为听太多而被开除的。”

Number nine: This is not the last one, but it is the most important one. Listen. 

I cannot tell you how many really important people have said that listening is perhaps the most, the number one most important skill that you could develop. Buddha said, and I"m paraphrasing, "If your mouth is open, you’re not learning." And Calvin Coolidge said, "No man ever listened his way out of a job."

第十条:简明扼要。

“好的交谈就像恰到好处的迷你裙;足够短,能够吸引人,又足够长,能够包纳(盖住)主体——我妹妹的比喻”,所有这些都浓缩成同一个概念,那就是:对他人产生兴趣。

我在一个名人外公身边长大, 我家里宾客络绎不绝。访客会前来和我的外祖父母交谈,而那些人离开后,我母亲会过来对我们说:“你们知道那是谁吗?她是美国小姐的亚军。他是萨克拉门托市长。她拿过普利策奖。他是俄罗斯芭蕾舞蹈家。”

我在成长中默认了每个人都有不为人知的精彩。说真的,我想是这一切让我成为了更好的主持人。我尽量少说话,但开放自己的思想,永远准备着大吃一惊,而我从不会感到失望。你们也可以这样。走出门去,和别人交谈,听别人说,以及最重要的,准备好大吃一惊。

One more rule, number 10, and it"s this one: Be brief. 

[A good conversation is like a miniskirt; short enough to retain interest, but long enough to cover the subject. — My Sister] All of this boils down to the same basic concept, and it is this one: Be interested in other people. 

You know, I grew up with a very famous grandfather, and there was kind of a ritual in my home. People would come over to talk to my grandparents, and after they would leave, my mother would come over to us, and she"d say, "Do you know who that was? She was the runner-up to Miss America. He was the mayor of Sacramento. She won a Pulitzer Prize. He"s a Russian ballet dancer." 

And I kind of grew up assuming everyone has some hidden, amazing thing about them. And honestly, I think it"s what makes me a better host. I keep my mouth shut as often as I possibly can, I keep my mind open, and I"m always prepared to be amazed, and I"m never disappointed. You do the same thing. Go out, talk to people, listen to people, and, most importantly, be prepared to be amazed.

以上就是今天分享的全部内容。不冒犯任何人,不三心二意,不好为人师,不要把自己的经历和他人比较,认真倾听,谨言慎行,但开放自己的思想,永远准备着大吃一惊。希望 Celeste Headlee 几十年工作总结出的 10 条交谈心得能帮助大家在与人沟通上更游刃有余。

作者简介：

李智

国家二级心理咨询师

已帮助过

1501人

入驻年限

8.3年

预约咨询

私聊